/** reg.easttimor: 2798.0 **/

** Topic: ABC Transcript: Evidence of ethnic cleansing in E Timor **
** Written 9:43 PM Sep 6, 1999 by Joyo@aol.com in cdp:reg.easttimor **
Subject: ABC Transcript: Evidence of ethnic cleansing in E Timor

also: Interview w/Australian doctor in Dili

The World Today Tuesday, September 7, 1999 12:10

Further evidence of ethnic cleansing in East Timor

COMPERE: And earlier this morning, as he and his wife prepared to close the Don Bosco Catholic Centre Clinic, Michael Tyquin's colleague, Dr Kevin Baker, another Sydney doctor, gave us details of the organised operation.

DR KEVIN BAKER: The residual refugees at Don Bosco, which is in Cormorou [phonetic] District, just near the Dili airport are going to be at some stage bussed from here forcefully after they're been told to sign a autonomy form saying they really wanted to vote for autonomy. And they're going to be bussed to Atamboa [phonetic] probably, to some form of refugee camp. And unfortunately we don't know what's going to happen to them after that.

We've been told that we must get these last two flights out of Dili and that's probably, probably we should do it now because there's nothing we could do medically any more. And there's a sort of sense of despair, I suppose. There's a great mass of people here. They sort of, everyone still smiles. They always forgive us. But it's a fairly emotional sort of scene.

TICKY FULLERTON: How far away is Atamboa?

DR KEVIN BAKER: I don't actually, strangely, we've been to many places, but I don't know, 40, 60 kilometres I think.

TICKY FULLERTON: But you fear the worst?

DR KEVIN BAKER: Well I do for the young. Because they've always been targeted. A week ago we knew that the base plan was to kill the young. I must admit that we didn't know that this unbelievable scenarios that's happened in the last 24 hours was going to occur. But we knew at least the paramilitary would try to get the young boys which has always been their target because they're the ones who may one day continue the battle. So we just worry what might happen to the youngster. I mean they tend to leave thankfully men, old men and women alone.

TICKY FULLERTON: Just how intimidating has the militia been over the last few days?

DR KEVIN BAKER: Around the compound, we've had constant fire. I mean last night there must have been several thousands rounds, basically probing the compound which is actually thankfully a large concrete fence. I mean really it was basically just to scare the large number of people here, the mums and dads and babies because they really weren't organised and probably brave enough to actually come down the road.

Incredibly the two head priests here sat on the road with the gates open which we'd kept closed for the last three days while we've all been in here, sitting on two chairs the whole night ready to welcome and accept the inevitable, which is quite an impressive sight actually.

TICKY FULLERTON: Kevin, how many people are we talking about?

DR KEVIN BAKER: Well it's changed now, Ticky. About, I mean 36 hours ago, there were about 12,000 here. That was an enormous number and it tripled over two days prior. But now many have leaked away. A lot of the young thankfully, young males, have headed for the hills which is an incredibly brave thing to do from where we are. It's a long distance, and hopefully they've made it. And a lot of other mums and dads have decided to chance it out in the streets.

TICKY FULLERTON: What do you think the thinking of the militia is? Are they going to replace people?

DR KEVIN BAKER: With whom? The following scenario, this is how we've heard it through the consulate here, that it's not really the paramilitary anymore. I mean it never was. It's always been orchestrated and we've watched that happen for the last couple of years here. The plan is, as we've heard it, is that they're going to clear Dili and - I know this sounds peculiar - but at some stage they're going to repopulate with non-East Timorese. Now that may not be a truism but that's the story we've heard.

TICKY FULLERTON: So clear ethnic cleansing?

DR KEVIN BAKER: Well I think you've got to say that. I mean we've always skirted around that as a country because we like to think it's not that. But I think they have. They just don't like, they see these people as lesser people.

COMPERE: Dr Kevin Baker there, speaking to us from the now abandoned Don Bosco Centre in Dili. That's been closed down because the militia have shipped all of the people out of it in trucks. Very ominous indeed.


The World Today Tuesday, September 7, 1999 12:12

Killing continues as militias move to clear East Timor

COMPERE: In East Timor the situation has become so grim that even Australia's Foreign Minister has thrown away the language of diplomacy, describing the situation as a slaughter.

But still we wait upon Indonesia, even as it becomes clear that a grand plan is being implemented to clear East Timor of those who support independence. Thousands are being shipped, even as we go to air, in trucks to holding centres, forced at gunpoint by militia thugs and Indonesian paramilitary police to sign documents saying they voted the wrong way in the recent referendum. The price of life on East Timor is now a vote for integration with Indonesia. The situation is so critical that in Dili people are becoming afraid to speak on the telephone.

You might recall our graphic eyewitness account in yesterday's program from Michael Tyquin, one of the handful of medical staff at the last medical clinic still operating in Dili. Well late this morning Ticky Fullerton managed to contact Michael again, to learn that the clinic and hundreds of women and children sheltering there are under threat of imminent attack.

DR MICHAEL TYQUIN: You've got 60 seconds, go.

TICKY FULLERTON: Okay, what happened last night?

DR MICHAEL TYQUIN: We had very intensive gunfire around the town. They attempted to burn the sisters residence down which is situated next door to the hospital. The whole thing is an absolute disaster. I can't really expand on it. I have not been able to get out of the hospital so I can't see what's happening in other parts of Dili.

TICKY FULLERTON: You have four French colleagues who are surgeons. Are they still with you?

DR MICHAEL TYQUIN: No, they had to go back last night. They are in Darwin at the moment. I still have, there is still a French surgeon here.

TICKY FULLERTON: And what about this evening?

DR MICHAEL TYQUIN: Well I'll be very much surprised if any of us are around after lunchtime. The militia are coming through and anybody that's moving, they kill, and anything that's standing they burn. I mean it's as simple as that. The people are fleeing westward as I speak. But as I said earlier, we've decided to tough it out here.

TICKY FULLERTON: And what about you? Have you got a way out?

DR MICHAEL TYQUIN: No, I'm not going. It's as simple as that. I can't leave patients in their beds while the militia come in and just do as they want. It's not feasible.

TICKY FULLERTON: And do you think this is lunchtime when they will hit?

DR MICHAEL TYQUIN: Well they're on the outskirts of the town and, look, anything could happen. It might stop. They might just go home for the day and start tomorrow. But it's not looking good at the moment.

COMPERE: Dr Michael Tyquin, the last Australian at the Motayel Clinic in Dili.

** End of text from cdp:reg.easttimor **